This Generation’s 1987 (Audio Podcast)

March 14, 2020

On this week’s podcast, Karl discusses the extreme volatility and historic fall in the stock market that can only be compared to 1987. Most investors have never seen a drop of this magnitude, and certainly not this fast.

Hey, good morning everybody. Welcome to Creating Richer Lives, the podcast. Thank you very much for joining us. As always, this show is brought to you by Covenant – Lifestyle, legacy, philanthropy. If you need our help in any form or fashion, or you need to comment about the show or a question, you can always call us at 2-1-0-5-2-6-0-0-5-7 or you can go to our website, which is

Well, where do I begin? This was a week for the ages for several reasons. I mean, we’ve been in a very tough market in a very short amount of time, haven’t we? We really were cruising along at all time highs and it was very interesting that while the coronavirus was going on overseas, and we knew about it for about a month or so, maybe longer. That the markets continued to go up. We knew the Fed was keeping interest rates on hold. They weren’t cutting but they weren’t raising. Economy was cruising along pretty well, and then the bottom fell out. It’s escalated and it seemed the peak. The peak fear really came Wednesday night.

So, we will get into that. And really I want to spend this podcast talking about what are we learning from this right now? What are you doing about it? What should you have done? What are you going to do? What are your emotions like? I mean, this is really where we learn and where you can potentially make a lot of money and some of you can lose a lot of opportunity because of selling out at peak fear. We’re going to talk through that because this is a really, really important podcast. These situations don’t happen that often, but when they do, they can change the trajectory of your retirement. They can change the trajectory of your legacy, your philanthropy, right? What you’re going to give to your kids, grandkids, charities, or what you’re going to spend on yourself. Your lifestyle. We’re going to go through those things.

All right, so let’s recap the week quickly, which honestly, I felt like after last week, we would come into Monday with potentially a stronger market because we saw some seesaw the week before. Remember that we saw a couple of thousand point plus days on the upside just as much as we saw on the downside. So we were, while we were gyrating a little bit, we actually had a positive week two weeks ago. We were up for the week and most people didn’t realize that and it was because the two big, big up days were bigger than the down days. So, we come into Monday, but unfortunately somebody threw a huge rock in the middle of a very calm or what was already maybe had some ripples to it, but a pond. And that was Saudi Arabia and Russia.

They could not come to an agreement. And we saw oil fall, the most it’s fallen, 30%, the most it’s fallen since the Gulf War. And that shock in that big of a move in one day just obliterated markets. And we know that with the economy that’s being essentially, being put on pause. Globally, at different times in different countries, but on pause and I say pause because it’s not stopping it’s pausing. That we know that that could have some effect on jobs, right? We could see unemployment start to tick up. We could see… I mean there’s a lot of potential things going on that could affect the economy.

Well, what’s going to happen in the energy space? Oil goes to $30 a barrel and are those folks going to be let go in the energy space? Are you going to see bankruptcies? And the answer’s probably yes. Especially if oil stays at these levels. So that was just something the market really didn’t need. And it was… It took everybody by surprise. That in the middle of demand destruction happening that Saudi Arabia and Russia would do this. Demand destruction, meaning you have China basically hunkered down. And so nobody’s driving, nobody’s doing anything. So that’s the demand side. And we already had a supply issue, we had enough oil.

So everybody thought, well they’re going to cut production, they’re going to come to an agreement. And Russia was like, “We always do this, we’re not doing it.” And Saudi Arabia is like, “Fine, then you know what? Not only are we not going to play that game either, we’re going to ramp up production.” And that was aimed at them. It was aimed at the shale producers and it just threw everybody by surprise. And so we saw Sunday evening, the futures limit down. So when they go down 5% after hours or up 5% they stopped trading. And that’s what happened. So you have no idea where the market’s going to open the next day. And we saw horrendous sell off on Monday and.., But the pattern had been, well maybe the next day would be up, right? Because that’s how the pattern has been, it was maybe one step forward, two back, but at least there’s some up days.

And we got that. The market opened up about a thousand points and it sold off. And maybe not a funny story, but I went and got a stress test last week, not because of the market. Although the timing probably wasn’t the best in the world, but I went and got a stress test. So I’m there Tuesday morning and it’s like a three hour deal, right? You got to sit underneath the panel of taking pictures for about 12 minutes and they go by and then you got to get up and wait for the treadmill test. They hook you up and then you got to get back off and do it again. So I’m waiting and the market’s up about a thousand points. So I put my phone in the little bin and I’m thinking, “Well, you know what? Let’s just not look at the phone right now. Let’s just get on the treadmill and do this test.”

But of course there was other people there and the other people were ahead of me. And so I had about a mm about a 20, 30 minute wait to sit there and do nothing. Well, what do we do nowadays when we have a 20 or 30 minute wait at any place in public? We grab our phones. We go check Twitter, we go read the news, we check fake book, we go look at Instagram, whatever you’re into. I like Twitter. I’m a news junkie and unfortunately it’s a bad habit, I will admit. But what did I do? I see my phone flashing. Dow erases 1,000 point gain and turns negative. Here we go. So I get on the treadmill and the lady says, “Your heart rate’s a little higher than normal.” And I didn’t go into why, but I knew why.

So anyways, everything checked out, by the way. Healthy heart, everything’s good. It wasn’t any issue that brought me there. It was just simply a routine check that I have not checked that in years and I’m 47 years old. So anyways. But the market managed to rally back over a thousand points at the end of the day. So we said, “Okay, good. It got back Monday’s losses, we’re going to have this back and forth.” Well that’s when the fun started because Wednesday the stock market fell 1,400 points and then Wednesday night is really was… I will say it was a surreal moment. Within the span of 15 minutes, the president gives his speech that really did not do anything for confidence in the markets. There was no specifics and I’ll get to that in just a minute. There was no specifics. It was just, “Hey, we’re doing the travel ban and that’s it.”

And he didn’t even explain the travel ban. So futures immediately dropped. Immediately dropped. At the same time, I’m getting a text or tweet saying that Tom Hanks and his wife had the coronavirus. And you’re thinking, “What is this? It’s fake, what’s going on here?” Nope, it’s legit. Then a basketball game’s about to start in Oklahoma City and the PA announcer, right when they’re about to tip off, says, “Stop. Stop, stop, stop. Everybody go home. Everything’s fine, but you need to leave this game to postponed,” or we’re not doing it. We find out one of the other players that wasn’t there, that was sick, had the coronavirus.

It was like all since things started to snowball, very, very quickly. And it was just surreal to watch, it felt like that things were just out of control. So of course, because of the president’s speech, I believe, or lack thereof that night, and because of this thing feeling real because we have real names to put to it. As far as one of the biggest actors of our generation. It just felt more real, I think to people. And so market falls 2,350 points. The biggest drop since the 1987 crash in one day.

Now this is this generation’s ’87 crash. 2008 I’ve been through the, as a professional, bubble. I’ve been through the ’08 financial crisis. Those were long. You wake up, you know you’re going to lose money and they’re just a grind everyday lower. And there’s some big moves, but they’re just a grind and there’s a lot of false rallies. This was a crash and I don’t use that term lightly, but that’s what we got. It wasn’t a one day crash, it was a multi-day capped off with Thursday’s 10% drop in the major indices. So mid-day the Fed injects $1 trillion. And the, hey, market loved it, for a minute. And then it sells off and we end up right down on… And close on the lows, that’s never a good thing. So you don’t know what you’re going to get Friday and lo and behold, market comes out pretty strong, tries to sell off.

Kind of had this feeling maybe that it would rally through the end of the day, but not maybe how strong it was. Finished up 1,900 points. And the timing of a very different tone, which is we’re calling this national emergency. Everybody’s on the same page. We’re working with public and private markets. Test kits, the whole bit, right? Everyone who’s begging for this and we got it. And lo and behold, the market rallies up. Now, we also heard buying oil for strategic petroleum reserve, smart, smart move. I don’t remember who this was. I think it was somebody with the New York Post. I don’t remember. But I heard somebody after the president’s first speech that left an empty feeling and the futures just went down. This gentleman came on and had some really good ideas that I thought were fantastic. One of them was, he said, “You need some very specific things, you need… Why not call Jeff Bezos and say, I need you to take a leave

Leave of absence from Amazon, and I need you to come help me and you’re going to be in charge of the distribution of the test kits, et cetera. You are the distribution king. You know how to get stuff to people in a quick manner. You’ll be in charge of that. How much confidence would that have exuded?

A lot.

Then he said, “What about Bill Gates?” Bring bill Gates onto the team and then why not get Schumer and Nancy Pelosi, take them to Camp David and say, “We’re not coming out of here until we get a deal.” Which, we got an agreement late Friday afternoon. Right.

I also was thinking, why not take off the tariffs temporarily from China? Wouldn’t that have given the markets a boost? I’m not sure why that wasn’t done, but these are very specific things and I think Trump knows that if this market continues to go down and this infection continues to percolate, and stay around and people are freaked out and can’t find toilet paper, that he’s going to lose. He knows that.

It was kind of a look in the mirror and okay, “Uncle,” and he capitulated and he did the right thing. It took a while and I honestly, this isn’t political. I just think he thought this would blow over and he didn’t want to scare people. He didn’t really want to have test kits out there. That’s just my theory. But, and then it backfired and it did escalate a little more than he thought. Now, I still have my views on the coronavirus in the big picture and I think a lot of it is overblown. Honestly, I feel that way. That’s not the point here. You may have a different opinion. My point is about the panic in the streets and the economic impact. I mean this, guys, this is the equivalent of a, picture yourself driving down a toll road, right?

You’re just cruising along. There’s no stoplights. There are no cars, really. You’re just cruising along, everything’s fine and somebody throws a barricade up in the middle of the street and you come to a complete stop. That’s what’s happened to the economy right now. Shutdown this, shutdown that. Quit travel and don’t do this. Don’t go eat out. Right. We’re going to have an economic impact and perhaps a likely recession, not the end of the world. That’s what the market’s pricing in though. But they’re going to move the barrier off of the road and we’re going to start accelerating once again. What we don’t know is when they’re coming back to get that barricade and move it. We don’t know that yet. If you are an analyst, what you do is, you communicate with companies on Wall Street and you say, “Hey, Casino Company, what are your earnings going to be for the next six quarters?”

They usually tell you, “This is what we think,” and everybody puts their estimates together and sometimes the companies beat those estimates. Sometimes they miss them, but they’re pretty close, right? The ones that are off get rewarded or they get penalized. That’s normal. If you go to Casino Company right now or an airline company or lots of different companies and ask them what their earnings are going to be for the next several quarters, do you think they have any clue at all? No. Companies are removing their guidance. They’re saying, :We’re not going to tell you because we don’t know.” So, if you don’t know what a company’s profits are going to be, how on earth can you value it? What does that do? Hit the sell button until we know more. That’s what we are in the middle of right now.

Now, when companies start coming out and saying, “We are going to lose, hypothetically $6 billion next quarter, and then the next quarter we’re going to lose 3 billion, and then we’re going to make a billion in the third or fourth quarter, at least you’ve got something to work with and you can start valuing. Then you can determine as a stock cheap or expensive, but you don’t know that yet. The one thing I think we can agree upon, and it didn’t feel this way Wednesday night when they’re canceling the whole NBA season at once. It didn’t feel this way. But most people agree, this is temporary. Wouldn’t you agree with that? This is temporary. So if it’s temporary, people are going to start flying again. This is like 9/11 right now. They’re going to fly again and probably in a faster, they’re probably come back to flying quicker than they did after 9/11, and things are going to ramp back up again.

We just don’t know when and how fast, but I think it’s going to happen sooner rather than later. Having said all of that, if it’s temporary, then how much do you discount the stocks? It seems a bit overdone, but it’s still the fear of the unknown. I really think, and I’ve talked to one of my employees, Casey Keller, for the last several years that we’ve seen, and I think I’ve mentioned it on these podcasts before, that we’ve seen these flash crashes, little, mini-flash crashes, right? We’ve seen one in 2010. We saw some real volatile movements in 2011. 2015 we saw, we woke up on a Monday morning. We saw stocks down 30%. we’ve seen some flash crashes with no explanation, and my bigger fear was not an ’08 financial crisis bear market. My bigger fear was a crash.

Now, crashes to me, are still temporary and they’re corrections. 1987 wasn’t a bear market. It was a correction. It took two years to get back to the old highs, roughly. I don’t know what it’ll take to get us back to the old highs right now. Two years? I have no idea, but the term correction verse bear market, you heard a lot of that this week. Well, we’ve sold off more than 20%, it’s a bear market. Who cares? You’re losing money, temporarily. The terminology doesn’t matter. But if you want to get, if you want to know the terminology, to me, a correction is, it’s about the duration. Is it lasting several months and years? That’s a bear market. A bull market is the opposite, but a correction is a violent, sharp sell-off that maybe lasts months. That feels like what we’re going through right now, especially given that just three weeks ago, we were at an all time high and now we’re in a bear market.

This is a news-driven shock to the system. You remember me saying those words and I didn’t know what it would be, but we’ve been saying for the last, really several months that the economy was good but not great. You remember us saying that? Good but not great. Everything we wrote about. That just meant that it was pretty good and the fact that the Fed wasn’t raising rates, that was awesome. I mean, it was a Goldilocks scenario and that’s why stocks were going up. But good but not great means it wasn’t, it was like a plane flying at 10,000 feet. It wasn’t flying at 30 or 40,000 feet. So, we didn’t have as much room to spare for air. And we said, a shock to the system, we’re for fragile enough that a shock to the system could put us into recession at some point.

Could be a conflict, like Iran, right. Remember that? Could be whatever. Didn’t know it was going to be a virus, especially one that, majority of the people are going to get over. But, it is and it’s their reaction to it. Doesn’t matter what it is, it’s the reaction to it and the fact that we are being mandated or self-selecting to not do stuff. That slows the economy down. We still don’t know when things ramp up and it’s hard to project. Markets are probably going to stay volatile, but it sure felt capitulatory on Thursday. It really did. But this is a multi-day crash. Now, let’s talk about what to do or not do about it. We have a lot of people that were in the market. I think this is also some unwinding that have never seen a move like this.

They’ve never seen this in their life. They’ve been buying the XYZ 2045 fund. They don’t know what’s in it. They just know they’ve been making a lot of great money and now they’re getting, it’s going down and conservative stuff’s going down. The last few days we saw some big moves out of the bond market down. So there hasn’t been a lot of places to hide. In fact, if he thought it was gold, no. If you thought it was cryptocurrencies, absolutely not. They’ve been obliterated. No safety net here. Remember Ray Dalio, several months ago, his famous quote on CNBC, cash is trash. Remember that? He’s getting a lot of flack for that because cash has been king and it was in ’08, and it has been lately. Now, if you had some cash prior to that, great.

But if you were invested, diversified, which you should be for the longterm, you didn’t have as much cash, but what are you doing about this right now? Because if you, are you in there rebalancing, taking advantage of cheap stocks? Are you selling? This is really, really important stuff guys. If you are in there right now selling and it was Wednesday or Thursday and you are selling, you have to really ask yourself, “Did I have the wrong allocation or am I just too emotional and I need to not be doing it?” These are challenging questions, but you got to be honest with yourself because you really should have a portfolio. When people say it’s for the longterm, that’s what we mean. We don’t mean just for markets that go up 7% a year. We mean can you withstand a 20 to 30% drop in your equity portion, right?

You shouldn’t have all stocks necessarily, in your equity portion. Can you stand that and can you go through that? Most people say yes when it’s going up and no when it’s going down. So, you’ve got to have this all-weather portfolio based on your situation and that’s, it’s really challenging. This was a scary week. The reason I say that is because it wasn’t like anything we’ve seen before. Markets are always different, but we haven’t seen and still are seeing the type of volatility. I mean, Friday morning we had the futures, were limit up so we’ve seen futures limit down multiple times this week. They were limit up. So, we’re seeing this back and forth and seeing the volatility at levels we’ve never seen before ever, ever. We’ve gone from all- time highs to a 25, 30% drop in days.

I mean, so what are we going to do about it? What are you going to do about it? Again, it’s about timeframes and this is important because if you are somebody living off of your portfolio, and I explained this numerous times this week to clients and they were understanding of exactly how this is working and how we set it up is, if you need to take money out of your account right now it’s coming from the more conservative income-based, non-stock portion. You don’t take it from the stock portion. That’s really important to understand because you don’t take it out pro-rata. Therefore, you have time for the stocks to recover. That’s how you have to segment a portfolio. But as always, I want to know what you were doing. This is how we help each other and talk about things, and get a sense of what’s going on out there.

Because, inevitably, lots of people sold Tuesday, Wednesday and probably Thursday. Lots of people will, probably Friday morning, lots of people sold because they couldn’t take it anymore. I can’t take it anymore. If your own dividend stocks, guess what? Those companies are still paying dividends. The value of the company has changed, but you own an asset. You didn’t lose the money. I think psychologically you have to quit saying, “I’ve lost this much,” because that’s a permanent type of comment. You don’t run around saying, “I made this much.” You didn’t make it. I mean, whatever you made in 2019, is gone at this point, potentially. It’s all temporary. How long are we invested for the long term here? Let me tell you something. There were some really good deals on individual stocks and sectors before this. There’s some unbelievable ones now, and I’m not

… giving any specific names, but I will say, I think some of the specific airlines are really interesting because, I’m not one for government bailouts, but they’re going to get one and they deserve one because of the fact that they’re being forced to not fly and do the things that they’re doing. That’s out of their control. So it’s a different animal than just some levered company that gets into trouble, and just because they’re in the financial services industry, they get a bailout from the government. That’s a different animal. So if you look at the airlines, they’re going to be helped by the government, people are going to start flying again, and some of them are cheap coming into this. Very interesting. And there’s lots of examples of that all over the map. But again, what are you doing about it and what did this teach you as far as your overall allocation? I mean, were you coming into this saying, “Hey, next dip, I’m buying baby.”

Then the dip comes and you’re like, “I’m buying that, it can go lower.” This is a very typical psychological example. Again, I can tell you for what we did this week. Here’s what we did. We used opportunities to rebalance. What that means is, hey, if your fixed income, your real estate, whatever we’re looking at has grown too much relative to the stocks, which it probably has in the last few weeks, you sell some of that and use that cash to buy stocks. If there’s cash in the money market that’s been sitting there, you go and nibble, and you average it and you nibble and nibble and nibble and you just keep purchasing and nibbling because that money’s for the longterm. But to be selling at the lows is very difficult. I don’t mean the lows as if we know where the low is. I just mean, when it’s 25 or 30% off it’s high, very hard to start making the decision, maybe I should start selling. I mean, again, go back to ’08 and there’s a big fork in there.

I’ve talked to literally hundreds if not thousands of people, I’m not exaggerating, since ’08. And I ask every one of them when they walk in the door, “What did you do if you were invested in the dot-com bubble and what did you do in ’08 and ’09?” I get one of three answers. Nothing, I sold and I still haven’t gotten back in and I don’t know what to do and I regret it, or I bought on the way down. Those three people tell me everything I need to know. In fact, I talked to a gentleman this week and he was feeling awful about the market. He said, “But you know what?” He goes, “I did move my 401k to the money market in ’08 and that was a dumb decision.” That is awesome. That is somebody who learned from that situation and isn’t going to do that this time. But this is a challenging time. I mean, it always is, but this is different than a normal pullback. This is different than even the financial crisis. This isn’t a financial crisis.

This is a [inaudible 00:03:19]. We were projecting the economy to do X and it’s definitely going to do Y, and it could do Z, but we don’t know, so we’re going to sell. Then what you’re seeing is companies tap their credit lines in advance. They’re like, “Hey, I need some cash to be there because if I need it, I need to draw on those credit lines. Boeing, I think it was $36 billion, their whole credit line that is tapped right now. So what happened was, the reason it was a smart move by the fed, they put $1 trillion into the banking system. Therefore, they make sure that those are well capitalized. Now the banks are in great shape relative to where they were in ’08. So it’s very different. But we just don’t know how big of a hit the economy’s going to take. But again, very challenging. I would also say this is a good time to look at your portfolio, and after cooler heads prevail, make adjustments, and even during the panic.

If you’re somebody that owns individual stocks, mutual funds, ETFs, what have you, it’s a time, even if you don’t want to get out of the market, you can still sell something, maybe even take a loss on it, lock it in as a capital loss and swap into something that may be better and still can go up the same rate as the other thing or has a potential to. So you didn’t lose anything but you got a capital loss on the books and you may be upgraded your portfolio. So take advantage of this time in a lots of different ways. It’s not just about buying in at the low, it’s not about dollar cost average, and all that is great. There’s other things you can be doing as well. I would also say, if you own individual companies, really understand what their balance sheets look like right now because if this is last longer then we think the economy is going to be slower than we think, companies are going to struggle longer. Who can last longer?

In the energy space there are certain companies that can last a long time with energy at 30 bucks a barrel and there’s a lot of companies who can’t, and the ones that can are going to put the little ones out of business. So you look at your companies and it’s very difficult. I mean, trust me, we’ve got Bloomberg machines, we’ve got elaborate spreadsheets, we’re looking at ratios, we’re checking all kinds of stuff. You’ve got to see who can make it and who can’t. It’s just a safety net to do that. So quality I think is important here. Now, when the market’s snapback, usually the most beaten up stuff goes the hardest. So sometimes when you upgrade quality, I’m going to get out of this “dog” and then I’m going to get into something better, you may be missing out on some rubber band effect and that happens a lot. So you just have to make a choice, do I want more higher quality, a little safety, or do I want to stay in the things that got beat up the most and I stayed too long?

But part of this going on right now, I really believe, and the reason I said I was worried more about crashes than a long withstanding bear market is because the proliferation of ETFs, fund of funds, putting non-liquid securities inside liquid securities, in other words, putting illiquid securities inside an exchange traded fund, it’s kind of a bad recipe, a bad combination. I really think maybe going forward, this is where mutual funds will start to shine again, having a manager overweighting certain areas and really knowing that particular market more than just saying, “I’m just going to buy an index.” This could be, who knows, but it could be a change in the way we look at this because everybody’s been going to low cost, simple low cost, and there’s a place for that. But I’m a firm believer in individual stocks at times. I’m a firm believer in individual bonds at times. I’m a firm believer in mutual funds at times, ETFs at times. They all have their pros and cons. Just don’t get stuck into one. But it was a very, very challenging week for sure.

I mean, look, if you know what you own and you’re okay with it, then you got to not look at your portfolio. You really do. Because if you know, hey, this is really… if I’m really for the longterm and I said I was and I’m comfortable with what I’m doing, then I just can’t get too upset about it because it goes up and it goes down, but over the long term it does pretty well. But it was a, like I said, a challenging week for pretty much everybody across the board. So I really appreciate you listening. Again, let me know what you were doing this week and kind of… I mean, be honest about what were your emotions were like. Were you close to clicking the sell button and didn’t? Did you sell Thursday and now you regret it? What does that look like? Again, just for me to kind of understand where you’re at. So, 210-526-0057 of course is our telephone number, is the website. If you ever want to email me, it’s Karl,, covenant, M as in Mary, F as in Frank, O as in

A lot of you do and a lot of you have been listened for a long time, we’ve got a bunch of new listeners of course. So welcome aboard. If this is your first podcast you listened to, you got doozy here because we had a lot of interesting stuff this week. I mean, there was so much stuff I could talk about, what was moving, what wasn’t. I mean, we didn’t even talk about the moves, but you had moves this week of gold miners, which are supposed to be the safe haven, down 50% this week, ish. You had Bitcoin down 40%, yet oil and gas stocks down 25 to 30%, homebuilders 20%. I mean, it’s all over the place. On the upside, of course the VIX, and this is with a 23% sell-off on Friday, the VIX still was up 36% for the week. And short treasuries made a lot of money this week, but technology held in there. So we’re still seeing this interesting situation where some of the expensive stocks are holding up just as well, if not better, than a lot of the cheap quality value stocks. We’re still seeing that.

So again, don’t be so closed-minded and say, “I only like this. Whether it’s a mutual fund, ETF, growth, value, I don’t do international. I hate international. I love US or whatever.” Don’t do any of that. Just have a balanced portfolio. We want to hit it down the middle of the fairway as much as possible here, and then on the fringe, you can pick your battles and overweight, underweight things. So I hope that was helpful. Give me your feedback. Don’t forget to share if you think this episode is helpful, especially if you’ve got friends calling you freaking out. Share this episode with them. Tell them we’re here to help them, and again, But you can share this if you listen on iTunes, Spotify, Stitcher, Overcast, you’re on our website looking at it. You can read it. Everything I’m saying right now is transcribed so you can read it on the blog in the page there on the website. So lots of ways to get our information.

So I’m going to go rest my voice, I’ve used it a lot this week, and just relax. That’s what I’m going to do this week. I hope you do the same. It’s a good thing markets are closed on the weekends, right? I mean, there was talk this week that maybe they should close the markets, but I don’t think they would do that for lots of different reasons. The only time I’ve really seen it in my lifetime was after 9/11 and that made a lot of sense. Right now, there’s no reason to close markets. A lot of the stuff is electronic and digital now, so they will close some trading floors, but most of this is done… I’ve spent a lot of time at the Chicago Mercantile Exchange, most of this is done electronically now. So anyways, that’s it guys. Have a great weekend and stay safe.

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